Jitendra Singh at Idea Exchange: ‘Gone are days when CBI was a caged parrot. This government has set it loose, thrown away the cage’

It’s not that. There have been instances where Indian scientists have been winning prizes. We had Dr Har Gobind Khorana (1968 Nobel Prize for physiology or medicine alongside two others). He chose to settle elsewhere. We also had Subrahmanyan Chandrasekhar (1983 Nobel Prize for physics alongside one other). Indian talent and acumen in science and technology are second to none. In fact, in spite of all constraints, we make up for much through the human resources of our scientific fraternity. The most striking example is that of space technology. When Dr Vikram Sarabhai started the Department of Space Technology, the Soviet Union and the US had already planned to land on the surface of the moon, which, of course, America did in 1969. Now, our inputs are being procured by NASA. The credit entirely goes to Prime Minister Modi. Before 2014, we just had about 350 startups in India. Today, we have more than 75,000 startups and more than a hundred unicorns. India is now ranked number three in the startup ecosystem of the world.

“We need to look at it from a broader perspective. The BJP, as a party, has always been consistent in its support to the cause (of Kashmiri Pandits) because this was the largest exodus happening within
the country”

HARIKISHAN SHARMA: India’s expenditure on science and technology has remained stagnant at less than 1 per cent (of the GDP) for the last several years.

There has been some enhancement in terms of allocation. For example, Gaganyaan has been given a separate allocation of nearly Rs 10,000 crore. Similarly, atomic energy has been given a fixed budget for an additional allocation for 10 years, every year, to expand its installations. Opening up space technology has also made room for public-private participation. Huge amount of revenue is being generated through launching foreign satellites from Indian sites. As far as nuclear energy is concerned, it was again, at the behest of Prime Minister Modi, that they have been granted permission to enter into joint ventures to raise funds. As a result, there has been expansion even in states where this was hardly talked about. For example, we are going to have a nuclear plant in a small town called Gorakhpur in Haryana. This will be the first nuclear plant in north India, in recent years.

We are also trying to extend our space centres of ISRO in other parts, to widen academic activity related to some of these elite science branches, which are confined to a few states.

We need to look at it from a broader perspective. The BJP, as a party, has always been consistent in its support to the cause (of Kashmiri Pandits) because this was the largest exodus happening within the country

HARIKISHAN SHARMA: When will India’s first human spaceflight be launched? Will it be before the 2024 general elections?

People may say it’s an election launch. We had an ambitious target to launch it at the 75th anniversary of Independence. But, unfortunately, COVID made everything go haywire. The training programme for the potential astronauts had to be interrupted. They had already been sent to Russia and had to be called back due to the lockdown. Now, we are at a stage where we would have two non-human trial flights, one possibly at the beginning of next year. The second one, which would be Vyom Mitra, the female robot, might be towards the end of 2023. Then, possibly, a proper human flight, totally indigenous, with an Indian, in 2024. Though we have had an Indian, Rakesh Sharma, in space, the mission was Russian.

LIZ MATHEW: We have been hearing both Prime Minister Modi and Home Minister Amit Shah talk about the achievements in Jammu and Kashmir. What is that achievement that the party and government are talking about?

Broadly, we would categorise it into three parts. First, the law and order situation. If you go by the figures, there has been hardly any stone pelting in the last one year. The number of killings has gone down. Visits of dignitaries, including that of the Home Minister, are happening in a smooth manner, which was never heard of in the last 30 years. I think the common man of Srinagar also wants to move on and be a part of the India journey under PM Modi. Second, the case of development. Many of the projects funded by the Centre were either halted or abandoned. They have been revived. For example, the Shahpurkandi dam project was planned way back in 1970s. That project is now going to be launched. A small town called Kishtwar is going to become the north India hub of powers. We have planned three-four projects, amounting to over 6,000 megawatts of power generation. There’s now a network of roads. Even my own district, Udhampur, has been figuring among the first three, on an all-India level, in the Pradhan Mantri Gram Sadak Yojana, for road construction. So the pace of development has increased.

Third is governance. Those who projected themselves to be the proponents of Article 370 were actually the greatest abusers. What was the justification for holding back Dowry Prohibition Act, 1961, for not having Prohibition of Child Marriage Act, 2006 there? These are not going to affect anybody’s identity or status. Article 370 was projected as having to do with the identity of the Kashmiris, but it was being used by two or three clans or families.

The way the startup movement is picking up in India, it may be possible that the job outside the government sector is much more lucrative compared to a government-salary job

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LIZ MATHEW: In one constituency, the ruling party has always been closely working with the Kashmiri Pandits. The country has seen a number of instances of severe protests in the Valley. Why is the government not addressing that?

We need to look at it from a broader perspective. When the displacement happened in 1990, the BJP came forward to the rescue even though we were not in power. So the BJP as a party has always been consistent in its unconditional support to the cause because this was the largest exodus happening within the country. Decisive action against the executors of crimes against Kashmiri Pandits has started happening in the last two-three years visibly, impartially. The second part of it is targetted killings. These are also happening as a part of weaning out terror. I firmly believe this is the last phase of terrorism. For 30 years, nobody ever tried to roll out any kind of programme or welfare scheme for them (Kashmiri Pandits), nor to bring to book those who committed these acts. It will take time to make up for all the wrongs done to them.

LIZ MATHEW: After the abrogation of Article 370, do you think more Kashmiri Pandits have returned than those who left?

I can’t say that. In 30 years, the generation has changed and many are occupied in their professions and businesses in different places. But those engaged in government jobs are going back. The government is trying its best to provide them safe residential accommodation, although it’s not always easy to give foolproof security against soft-target killing, which can happen anytime to anybody.

” The way the startup movement is picking up in India, it may be possible that the
job outside the government sector is much more lucrative compared to a government-salary job”

DEEPTIMAN Tiwary: At a time when the government is unable to ensure their security, Kashmiri Pandits who are engaged in jobs in the Valley are either being threatened that they will be chucked out of their jobs, or that their salaries will be cut if they are not in office. So they’re saying that the government is trying to ensure their presence in the Valley at the cost of their lives, just to show that Kashmiri Pandits are safe here.

I’ll not subscribe to that because this is a government which has been consistently supporting the cause of Kashmiri Pandits, even when we were not in power. I don’t think it would be fair to say that we could use Kashmiri Pandits for other political motives. Their safety is, of course, a matter of concern. But at the same time, Kashmiriyat, that composite culture by which Kashmir was known all over the world, was made up of the presence of Kashmiri Hindus and Muslims. So, in the absence of Kashmiri Pandits, Kashmir will no longer be Kashmir. But not that they are being made sacrificial goats. Any killing is of concern and, most of all, of our Kashmiri Pandits because they have suffered and became homeless in their own homeland. It is one of the worst tragedies that could happen.

P VAIDYANATHAN IYER: What are your views on (Ghulam Nabi) Azad sahab launching his own party?

I don’t think I should be talking about that, because he is a senior person and has been kind to us. But as an observer, I would say that it speaks of the lack of inner democracy within the party that he left, if he chose to do so after about half a century. I was telling somebody the other day what is different in our party. The values of democracy are being practised in public life but also within the party. You can’t predict who will be the next president in the BJP. In the Congress, it has become so predictable over the years, it took a toll on some of the people who had come with certain value commitments.

In all wisdom and discretion, there is the option to start an award (in the sciences). But what was happening was that awards were getting multiplied without much thought. So we sought to rationalise it

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ESHA ROY: The Centre is rationalising science awards. You yourself have said that there will now be six or seven big science awards, instead of hundreds of them. Many scientists agree that a certain amount of rationalisation is required. However, one of the concerns is that India is a big country, there are so many scientists and so many different sectors, that you may not be able to cover (all). Since science is being looked at as the foundation for growing the economy, don’t you think scientists need to be incentivised with more awards?

We have not stopped the institution of an award. In all wisdom and discretion, there is the option to start an award with due diligence. But what was happening was that the awards were getting multiplied without much thought. So we sought to rationalise it. If an award is coveted, that word ‘coveted’ should get justified. That does not necessarily mean that we will not be awarding or felicitating or honouring the idea of it. We are open to instituting awards with a new outlook, a new format.

ESHA ROY: At a recent congress in Hyderabad, you talked of how the geospatial-sector economy is likely to be over 63,000 crore. What new areas do you think will come up? Will India get its own Google Maps, for instance?

We are in the process of that. What I was telling foreign delegates even that day was that we have some success stories that you will never be able to accomplish, not because I’m underestimating your capacity or talent, but because you don’t have that kind of resources. We have launched one of the most successful stories thus far with the Swamitva programme — a mapping of the land through geospatial technology. We have more than 7.5 lakh villages spread all over the areas, different topographies, different climates, and different geographical conditions. Almost 2.5-3 lakh villages have already been mapped and more than 45 lakh km roads. This is going to contribute hugely to the economy, because they save manpower and time and improve the quality of the outcomes, which are more sustainable. If you have to be a part of the global world, we have to live up to global benchmarks. Today, the world is ready to look up to India. It’s up to us to build our capacity to take that lead role.

HARIKISHAN SHARMA: One of the charges which the Opposition has levelled on your government is of the very high rate of unemployment. This year, we saw the PM announce that the government will recruit 10 lakh people in the next one-and-a-half years. Have the ministries submitted their roadmap to DoPT and how many have already been recruited?

All the ministries are working on that. Fast track recruitment is happening even today. But looking at the issue of unemployment as a whole, I will say, what is a problem is the mindset which is inherent in our feudal legacy. Employment does not mean a government job. No country in the world can provide a salaried job to each and every youth. But yes, a responsible government, like the one headed by Prime Minister Modi, would always be conscious of creating avenues of employment. So, this entire startup movement is motivated by that, going from 350 to more than 75,000 startups.

So, employment will be there. The way the startup movement is picking up in India, it may be possible that the job outside the government sector is much more lucrative compared to a government salary job.

HARIKISHAN SHARMA: The way the government tried an experiment with the Army by introducing the all-India Agnipath scheme, do you think the time has come to try this with the All India Services also?

This is an ongoing process. But yes, in the last few years, there have been changes very consciously made in the curriculum of civil services, both in the pre-civil services entry level, during civil service, and post entry. Agnipath is not strictly [integrated] with civil services, but the interaction between the Lal Bahadur Shastri National Academy of Administration trainees with the Army institutes has started happening. I think more of integration, even in administration, is called for.

DEEPTIMAN TIWARY: Poor relations between the Centre and states have precipitated recently in that bureaucrats are being summarily summoned to Delhi or states not relieving them for central deputation. How do you think this can be resolved?

In the true spirit of cooperative federalism, I can say with a certain degree of evidence, we have followed that mantra. It’s only some non-cooperative states run by other parties, which behave in a manner not compatible with healthy democratic practices. For example, there are many states which have withdrawn general consent to CBI to interrogate their states. Most infamously, you have West Bengal, Kerala, Punjab. On the other hand, just about 10 years ago, we had a huge CBI interrogation going on in Gujarat, and the chief minister, the present Prime Minister, was making himself available for seven-eight hours. Never once did the Gujarat government withdraw consent to the CBI to interrogate.

What happens is that these officers undergo problems at the time of empanelment because they would not have sufficient number of mandatory deputation years at the Centre. Sometimes, the political dispensation finds some officer more convenient. The officer also finds it a win-win situation. But when the political dispensation changes, he faces a problem. So, for that, professionalism on part of the officer, and a more ethical approach on part of the political dispensation is what is a solution in the long run. But we are going to make a certain number of deputation years mandatory. Otherwise it might adversely affect the empanelment of an officer.

HARIKISHAN SHARMA: The Indian Express published an investigation a few weeks ago — we found that of 124 leaders who were facing CBI cases in the last eight years, almost 95 per cent were from the Opposition camp. Is it a coincidence?

I will not like to answer that because the CBI is an independent body. It doesn’t follow my diktats. Gone are the days when the CBI was a caged parrot. That was said of the earlier government, not of this government. This government has let loose the parrot and thrown away the cage. We don’t know what the CBI is doing, nor do we interfere in their working. This government is always inclined to respect the independence of autonomous bodies.

Why Jitendra Singh

Jitendra Singh is the minister who holds six — the maximum — portfolios in the present Narendra Modi government. He is Minister of State (MoS) (Independent Charge) in two ministries — the Ministry of Science and Technology and the Ministry of Earth Sciences. He is also the MoS in four other ministries — the Prime Minister’s Office; Ministry of Personnel, Public Grievances and Pensions; in the Department of Atomic Energy and, Department of Space. He is a two-term Lok Sabha member and represents the Udhampur Lok Sabha constituency in Jammu and Kashmir. A medical practitioner by profession,
Dr Singh has also authored eight books