Instead of being with the people,you (Left cadres) became above the people

We had our doubts. We told the CPM then that this is an issue. The nuclear deal involves so many technicalities that it is difficult to explain purely on the basis of anti-imperialism. We didnt think this could become an issue for the elections. Our point of view was that there were a number of problems affecting the livelihood of the people farmers issues,price rise,non-availability of food. Those were issues that could be explained to the people. The nuclear deal wasnt.

We agreed (with the pullout decision) after discussion. But in the preamble of the letter we gave for the pullout,we mentioned the economic issues. The nuclear deal,we said,had made it impossible to go along with the government.

As far as the stand on the deal is concerned,there is no difference in the Left parties. We differ only on the issue of pullout.

One of the reasons identified for the electoral defeat by the CPMs central committee is arrogance of cadres.

The CPM,being the biggest partner in the Front,is head of government in West Bengal and Kerala. In the course of that,the behaviour and lifestyle of cadres has altered considerably. Communist modesty,simplicity gave way to arrogance and bossism. And the tendency to interfere in all aspects of life of the common people even in a club,even in a school committee. This caused resentment in the people and is one of the causes of alienation of cadres from the masses.

To a much smaller extent,this could be seen in cadres of other Left parties. But they were not regarded as the bosses in social and political life.

One of the first things we will have to change primarily the CPM,as the largest party is the behaviour and approach of the cadres towards the people. All of us have to change and correct ourselves. But the bigger party has to change the most.

I want to emphasise that this has been pointed out with a view to improve the relationship between parties and also between party cadres and the people. Left unity is a must if in this country the Left has to make a mark against other parties.

Have you brought up the problem of cadres with the leadership of the CPM earlier?

It has been pointed out a number of times during Singur,Nandigram. But there is unilateralism practiced by the CPM in dealings with other parties of the Front.

In Kerala,for instance,the CPM has been encroaching on the seats that used to be contested by other partners of the Left,the RSP and JD(S). It came down to the CPI too. We used to contest four seats,they wanted to cut it down to three. Through this method,the CPM,which used to contest 11 out of the 20 seats in Kerala,contested 14 this time.

On the question of the ban on the CPI(Maoist),it appears that in the Left,the party is at odds with the West Bengal Government. There are also differences of opinion within the Left Front in that state.

All Left parties,including the CPI and CPI(M),have the same view that applying the ban is no solution. If the ban was to solve the problem,then Maoists should be weakened in Jharkhand and Orissa. They are not.

Secondly,the CPI(Maoist) does not function legally even today. They take recourse to illegal armed action. The ban only arms the police and administration with arbitrary powers to arrest and prosecute people.

This is exemplified by the arrest of the CPI(Maoist)s Gaur Chakraborty. He was not arrested because he was carrying arms or was engaged in armed action in Lalgarh. He has been arrested in Kolkata,simply because he is a member of the CPI(Maoist).

We have suffered bans. We have been arrested,not because of any action,but because we belonged to an illegal party. In 1950-51,I was arrested and imprisoned for one-and-a-half years because I belonged to the CPI. When I came out,I was literally on the deathbed due to a 54-day-long hunger strike in jail. For two years after that,I went underground. I was declared an absconder.

The ban only empowers the police and administration to arrest and prosecute people for belonging to an illegal organisation,not for any overt activity.

That is why we are saying,the ban itself is not enough. What is necessary is political action to win over the people who may have been misled by the Maoists. This must be coupled with administrative action wherever Maoist action crosses the legal limit,as in Lalgarh.

So what needs to be done in Lalgarh?

Police action against Maoists must not become military action against the adivasis. This will only alienate them further. Even while police action is going on,we are saying proceed cautiously,there must be no harassment of women.

Moreover,suppose you have liberated villages today,what about tomorrow? You have to win back the people. Every inch that you advance into the area,you have to organise relief,medical help,reopen schools,ensure people return to their normal lives.

But how do you win back hearts and minds with cadres that have become arrogant?

Cadres,their lifestyles,have to change. The founders of socialism envisaged that the cadres relationship with the people would be like fish and water. You cannot become sharks.

The whole problem in a place like Lalgarh starts with the neglect of the people,and arrested development. Though land reform has been carried out in Lalgarh and the adivasi peasant has been the beneficiary,and panchayats have worked,power goes to the head of cadres,who are also drawn from among the adivasis. Instead of being with the people,you became above the people.

During the run-up to the trust vote last July,a statement you made seemed to put the Left imprimatur on Mayawati for PM. How do you look back at the Lefts wooing of Maya,now that the BSP has also performed so far below expectations?

The media asked me about Mayawati projecting herself as prime minister,and I said so many are doing the same thing one of them even projects himself as PM-in-waiting. Mayawati is at least the Chief Minister of Indias largest state where she has delivered a single party majority after nearly two decades.

The whole concept of the Third Front did not click with the people. They considered it unrealistic and unstable in a country that faces so many problems.

But Mayawati frittered away the goodwill she had earned by her arbitrary and megalomaniacal actions. I can understand a memorial to Kanshi Ram. But not these statues of Mayawati. We dont build statues for living persons. That is not our culture.

At what point in the Lok Sabha campaign did you sense that things are not going to happen as you had hoped on the BSP front?

We could see that the BSP was losing goodwill after the engineer was murdered at Auraiya. Also,she made the political mistake of thinking that she could fight on all seats alone. She alienated herself from all other political formations.

How do you view the current turbulence in the BJP? Do you think it can transform itself into a western-style party of the right?

The BJP has been a right-ist force since it was born in the Jan Sangh and it will remain a right wing party,congenitally against the Left. They cannot become more right than they are today. But the BJPs dilemma has to do with Hindutva. The RSS core is wedded to it.

The exercise that Advani and Co. are conducting now is to make it palatable. They talk of inclusive Hindutva. The word inclusive has become fashionable. Like inclusive growth. But you dont become inclusive just by using the word.

When people like Varun Gandhi and Narendra Modi came forward during the campaign,a spectre was created,and people moved to the Congress because of it.

The BJP didnt do anything about this while the polls were on. Now they are acknowledging it was a problem. Now Varun Gandhi is meeting P Chidambaram,asking for greater security to isolate himself,guard himself against the people.