The Bucha killings, WHO on Covaxin, and the viral namaz video

Next, Indian Express’ Kaunain Sheriff explains why the World Health Organization (WHO) has suspended the supply of Covaxin through UN procurement agencies (10:58).

And in the end, Indian Express’ Iram Siddique tells us how the video of a 22 year old muslim woman offering namaz went viral (18:38).

TRANSCRIPT

Shashank Bhargava: Hi, I’m Shashank Bharagava, and you are listening to 3 Things, the Indian Express news show. In this episode we talk about why the World Health Organisation has advised countries not to purchase Covaxin. We also talk about how a 22 year old Muslim woman from Madhya Pradesh was targeted by Hindu right wing groups. But first we talk about the Russian invasion of Ukraine. Earlier this week, devastating and disturbing images came out from Bucha, a town which is about 25 kilometres away from the Ukrainian capital. In Bucha, more than 300 dead bodies were found, some with the hands tied, flesh burned and shot in the back of the head. Corpses were also found in a shallow mass grave and official say that a children’s sanatorium was used as a torture chamber for civilians. Satellite images from a couple of weeks back also show that the streets of Bucha are scattered with dead bodies. On Tuesday, Ukraine President Vladimir Zelensky, in his address to the United Nations Security Council, accused Russian troops of committing the most terrible war crimes since World War Two.

Volodymyr Zelenskyy: The Russian military searched for and purposefully killed anyone who served our country. They killed entire families, adults and children. And they tried to burn the bodies. They cut off limbs, cut their throat, slashed their throats, women were raped and killed in front of their children. They were their tongues were pulled out only because the aggressive did not hear what they wanted to hear from them in Ukraine, the most terrible war crimes of all times. We see it since the end of World War Two and they are being committed. The massacre in our city of butcher is only one unfortunately only one of many examples of what the occupiers have been doing on our land for the past 41 days.

Shashank Bhargava: Now after the massacre came to light, countries from around the world condemned the incident. This also included India, which on Tuesday told this to the United Nations Security Council.

India at UNSC: The situation in Ukraine has not shown any significant improvements since the council last discussed the issue. The security situation has only deteriorated as well as its humanitarian consequences. Recent reports of civilian killings in Russia are deeply disturbing. We unequivocally condemn these killings and support the call for an independent investigation. India continues to remain deeply concerned at the worsening situation and reiterates its call for immediate ceccession of violence and end to hostilities. We have emphasised right from the beginning of the conflict, the need to pursue the path of diplomacy and dialogue.

Shashank Bhargava: In this segment, Indian Express’ associate editor Shubhajit Roy joins us to talk about the response to these killings and the significance of India statement. Shubhajit, in its statement regarding the killings in Bucha, India said that it unequivocally condemns the killings, described them as deeply disturbing and called for an independent probe. What is the significance of India saying this, considering that it has been walking a pretty tight diplomatic rope where it does not want to hurt its historic ties with either Russia or the United States?

Shubhajit Roy: Yeah, Shashank, you know, as you will have noticed, this is by far the strongest statement by India so far on Russia in action since February 24, when Russian troops invaded Ukraine, and war has been going on for more than five weeks now. In fact, it will be six weeks today, since the war began. And India has maintained a sort of posture of neutrality, because it has strategic partners on both sides of this war. But what changed is that these recent killings of civilians whose graphic images are now all over television, social media, and everywhere, that has really sent shockwaves not in the international community and in Delhi as well. So there was actually that space that India has created that diplomatic space that has created by talking to both sides giving statements while abstaining giving statements underlining territorial integrity, sovereignty, all these issues, which essentially are Red lines for Russia, these images of bodies lying on the streets of Bucha really has sort of shrunk the space. So India had actually no option but to unequivocally condemn these killings and call for a independent probe, which is the Ukrainian demand, also demand by the Western partners.

Shashank Bhargava: And it was T. S. Tirumurti, India’s permanent representative at the UN who made the statement. Was there anything else that stood out for you in terms of what he said?

Shubhajit Roy: I think the language: the fact that India chose to use the phrases like equivocally condemn these killings, it didn’t say the incident it specified these killings and said that recent reports of civilian killings in Bucha, it was very specific of it’s not talking about war, casualty in terms of troops. So just casualty talked about civilian killings in Bucha, are and said that deeply disturbing. So choice of these words was very, very important, because language is what diplomats usually use to convey the seriousness of an incident of an issue. And that’s why India’s Permanent Representative T. S. Tirumurti without naming Russia actually condemned Russian actions. And the fact that it supported the call for an independent investigation shows that it is step closer to the Ukrainian and the western partners demand for an independent probe.

Shashank Bhargava: And do we know how Russia will react to this, how it will view these statements compared to how it has viewed India’s position so far?

Shubhajit Roy: Well, Russia, obviously is watching India’s statements very carefully. It has, in the past called India’s stand as unbiased, principled, balanced, if you remember, Sergey Lavrov, the Russian Foreign Minister, he came to India. He also praised India’s position saying that India has taken a view of the events and the entirety of facts. So Russia has so far been very positive about India’s statements, although India has abstained on both the Russian revolutions as well as us or Western sponsored resolutions at the UN Security Council, but we’ll have to see how Moscow responds to these new statement by India. So far, there’s been no such statements.

Shashank Bhargava: And how have other countries reacted to these killings in Bucha?

Shubhajit Roy: Yeah, I mean, the restaurant reaction has been very, very strong. I mean, US Secretary of State Anthony blinkin, who in fact, spoke to External Affairs Minister S. Jaishankar, twice within a span of a week, the last call was on Tuesday night. And just before the Indian statement, he has said that, you know, these Bucha images are a punch to the gut. And they said that we believe that Russian forces have committed war crimes. And we have been working to document that. British Foreign Secretary Liz Truss, who was also in India last week, said that Russia’s indiscriminate attacks against innocent civilians must be investigated as war crimes. So the temperature in the West is very, very high. And they have all called it war crimes, and they want it to be investigated.

Shashank Bhargava: So Shubhajit, while this is being condemned by so many countries, what has Russia said in response?

Shubhajit Roy: So the Russians have obviously rejected this allegation, and said that the Russian envoy at the UN, Vassily Nebenzya, he said what happened in which is exactly a false flag attack by the Kiev regime, and its Western sponsors, essentially, meaning that this is a hoax. This is a staged operation. And he tried to rubbish, these images or allegations of Russian troops committing these killings.

Shashank Bhargava: Also, one thing that we have seen over these past weeks, is that Russia’s invasion has not gone as planned. According to media reports, it has been hard for Russia to continue with this war. Could you talk a bit about how things are proceeding on that front?

Shubhajit Roy: Yeah, in last six weeks now of the war, we’ve seen Russia’s invasion has not obviously gone as per the plan. One would have thought initially that populations thought that it would be quick can be over within a few days. But the Ukrainian resistance has been pretty strong, supported and aided obviously by the Western partners who have supplied equipment, arms and intelligence. So that has halted the Russian advance.v Now obviously, Russia is in a position right now where it is feeling the heat of sanctions over long term in the short term as well. So that will have a bearing on its next steps as well, whether it wants to go for a prolonged campaign or it calls a victory by just claiming victory that it has done by sundered control, and that it was just there to teach a lesson to Ukraine. So these are questions that Russia will have to ponder over and I’m sure Kremlin they must be discussing and debating this Indian assessment has always been that this kind of conflict has to be resolved by direct talks between Russia and Ukraine. In fact, this has been conveyed by the Indian Prime Minister to with his conversations with both the Russian and Ukrainian presidents as well. So I think that is something we’ll have to see how the Russian campaign Russian war invasion comes to an end.

Shashank Bhargava: And next we talk about Covaxin, India’s first indigenous vaccine for COVID-19. For the past many months Covaxin which has been developed by Bharat biotech was being supplied to countries across the globe. But now the World Health Organisation has advised these countries to put a stop to that and suspended the supply of Covaxin through UN procurement agencies. In this segment, Indian Express’s Kaunain Sheriff who reports on health for the paper, joins us to talk about the reasons why the WHO has done that. Kaunain, Covaxin had received emergency use listing from WHO back in November. And based on this it could then be supplied to other countries. So why is it now that the WHO has stopped its supply?

Kaunain Sheriff: Yeah, so Bharat biotech after an extensive four to five rounds of scrutiny received an emergency use listing by the WHO. It became the second vaccine to receive an emergency use listing. The other one is Covishield. What it means is that a majority of vaccines to the lower and middle income countries is being administered through what we call as a Gavi CEPI Alliance. You know, these are vaccines which go as donations, so WHO strikes deals with vaccine manufacturers and procures vaccines and then sends it as donations to these countries. So technically, when Bharat Biotech received this UL, it was actually thinking that it could send some of its vaccines to the GAVI CEPI Alliance, like how billions of doses of Covishield has gone through that route. Okay, so that’s the first thing. Second thing is still date Bharath Biotech has not received a single order from the WHO for procurement of its vaccine, to supply it for donations to other countries, the second thing. And the third thing is independently however, for vaccine has received approvals, which we call as an emergency use authorization for approximately 25 countries where it has supplied through commercial contracts.

Shashank Bhargava: So even though co vaccine has been supplied to other countries through commercial orders, it has not been supplied through WHO.

Kaunain Sheriff: You’re right, you’re right. So that’s what is happening, because it has not received any orders from the WHO through the UN agencies. So what happened last week was that the WHO for all the vaccine manufacturers who have received UL has been conducting inspection these inspections are linked to what we call as good marketing practices. So there is a template you know, there is a global template of what exactly and what are the requirements of a vaccine manufacturing facilities. In this case covaxin is manufactured in a very high containment facility what we call as a BSL3 facility. So there are specific criteria or requirements that require for a COVID-19 vaccine. The WHO inspection in the third week of March has come out and said that there are some things that are lacking in Bharath Biotech’s plant in Hyderabad, specifically in Hyderabad and because of which it has issued a Global Advisory like I highlighted that although Covaxin is not being supplied to UN agencies at all as of now because it has not received any of the orders. However, they have issued an advisory that it has stopped, that countries who want to procure right now should stop the supply of Covaxin because it does not meet the requirements of the GM. So that’s the order that has come.

Shashank Bhargava: Okay, so according to the WHO it doesn’t meet certain criterias that COVID-19 vaccine facilities should. So what are these requirements that Bharat biotech does not meet?

Kaunain Sheriff: So, firstly, there are three issues related to it. First is that India’s own regulator also has conducted its own inspection before Bharath Biotech started doing the production of Covaxin. So our own regulator has agreement a green signal for producing because of the fact that it meets the requirements. The second thing is that most of these facilities bees that were used for production of Covaxin were repurposed facilities, which means that they were using facilities used for rabies vaccine. They were using facilities that were being used for rotavirus and typhoid vaccine. So, these were repurposed facilities. Now, every vaccine has various very specific requirements for production, especially Covaxin, because you are actually inactivating the entire vaccine in case of Covaxin. So, what the WHO says this there, there have to be some upgradation the exact analysis and the outcome of this inspection was they need to be in upgradation of the facility, because remember, in the inspection, they have clearly said that vaccine despite the existing facility meets the standards of safety and efficacy of the vaccine. So that has not been compromised as of now.

Shashank Bhargava: So basically, what they’re saying is that the vaccine is as effective as it claims to be and there are no safety concerns. The only issue is in the manufacturing facility.

Kaunain Sheriff: Yeah, exactly. So since they were using repurpose facilities, what Bharat biotech did was they did a risk assessment exercise that whether with the existing facility can they actually produce a safe vaccine which would show that yes it you know, with with the existing facility, they can, you know, the risk is very low considered that the requirement of the urgency of producing vaccine is very high. So, now, since the production of Covaxin has been, in fact, not just been discontinued, at least in four or five centre, now they can be in a position to undertake this upgradation that’s what the sources in the company are telling us.

Shashank Bhargava: Okay, so while Bharat biotech is upgrading its facility, to what extent will it affect the supply the supply of Covaxin?

Kaunain Sheriff: So, two things firstly, you know, this whole upgradation itself, it’s a very complex process, there is going to be a very detailed scientific examination of what exactly WHO, so, WHO has sent them very preliminary documents of what the upgadation is required, based on that they will come back with their own what is called as the CAPA action or what is what is corrective action, which is followed also by the drug companies. Now, based on that, the company says that most of the upgradation procurement has to take place through foreign countries. In fact, this cannot be bought on shelf will take at least six to seven months for them to even get the equipment. So what they’re trying to do is they have already created an antigen bank. So antigen bank is like a bulk product of the vaccine. So, the antigen bank has been kept in case if there is sudden requirement of Covaxin, they can easily produce six to seven crores using the antigen bank. So that’s the preliminary plan right now, even as they are undertaking this CAPA exercises the corrective action exercise they have already created an antigen bank. And then if by chance that there’s another wave, or there’s a requirement of Covaxin, because right now, you know that the vaccine is just being used for children right now. And, you know, it’s almost 80 to 85% of the children have received the first dose and almost 65% have received the second dose. So that’s the first thing. The vaccine is not being used outside the country. They’re not received fresh orders from other countries. And third thing is, you know, the UN itself has not procured or striked any deal with Covaxin for supply to the lower and middle income countries. So right now, because of this, they have already shut down their facility in Ankleshwar where they have also shut down a vaccine facility in Malu, that is Bangalore. And there’s just one facility that is manufacturing the remaining orders in Hyderabad. So right now, production is not a problem because they don’t have fresh orders. But even if they have to scale up they have already created an antigen bank where you know, they can scale it up within a month’s time.

Shashank Bhargava: And next we talk about an incident that once again raises concerns of religious intolerance and targeting of minority communities. The incident involves a 22 year old woman from Madhya Pradesh. The woman we’ll call her Sadaf, even though that’s not her real name, is in her University’s final semester, and she hopes to become a teacher soon. Last month, Sadaf’s video went viral, and the video was actually taken without Sadaf’s permission. If you were to see the video, it is a bit puzzling why it would go viral. Because all Sadaf is doing in the video is offering namaz in an empty room. The room is at a university which is in Madhya Pradesh, Sagar district. But this video has gone viral thanks to right wing social media handles that have written to the university demanding that action should be taken against her. And Sadaf because of this is now being targeted. When we spoke to Indian Express’s Iram Siddique, she told us how the entire matter started.

Iram Siddique: So the incident happened on March 25. It was a Friday. The girl who we are calling Sadaf was seen offering Namaaz in the Department of Education. She is a fourth year student. She is pursuing this course called BSc-BEd. It’s an integrated course offered by the Harisingh Gaur University which is located in Sagar district. She is in her last semester. So she has been offering namaz whether it was in her hostel or on some occasions in her department, which is basically the BSc department. And on that particular day, there were also elections being held for class representative. She’s a meritorious student. So she had also nominated herself for class representative. And it was during the afternoon art at around 12:30-1pm When she went into a passage, which is basically adjacent to the library and the library was closed, so a small area where there were just furniture lying around and that small area, she was praying Namar when the video was shot from behind without her knowledge, she had no idea that the video was made.

Shashank Bhargava: It was only later that evening that one of her friends told her that her video is going viral. The issue just blew up from there. And by the next day, a local newspaper reported on it. And there was suddenly a debate about whether or not a Muslim woman can offer namaz in a public space like this.

Iram Siddique: And what is the right way to go about doing so if she wants to offer a Namaz and whether the university was right in allowing her to do so. So that was the context. I mean, the next day of the debate from what the girl told me that the next day she read that thing in the newspaper and it still was very strange to her because she felt I was just praying I mean, why is it even news and then suddenly in the afternoon, you had Around 40-50 people affiliated with the Vishwa Hindu Parishad and Hindu jagaran Manch, who went to the campus and decided Hanuman Chalisa as a mark of protest to this particular incident. And then subsequently, they also gave a memorandum to the Vice Chancellor of the University in which they cited that, you know, recently the Karnataka High Court had banned women from wearing hijab in Educational Institute as a practice and although they had left it to the discretion of respective states to decide as to what they want to do, the memorandum submitted by the Hindu jagaran Manch said that that incident had created a lot of communal tension. And now we have a similar practice in Sagar University and Dr. Harisingh Gaur University where a woman was seen offering a namaz and that they oppose this particular incident. And they have demanded action against the girl failing, which if the university fails to do that, they said that they will hold protests against the administration.

Shashank Bhargava: After this, the university issued a notification, which, among other things, said that as far as religious practices are concerned, students should do so at their homes, or at their place of worship, and that the university should only be used for academic purposes.

Iram Siddique: And if any student was found violating these rules, they will be held responsible and disciplinary action would be taken against them. So they have said that you cannot indulge in any kind of activity that promote communal tension or disrupt the peace and harmony of the university. That’s what they said. And after that they constituted a six member committee to investigate into this incident and submit recommendations to the university on what they can do.

Shashank Bhargava: But when Iram spoke to the teachers of the university, they told her that once the university has already issued a notification, there’s not much that they can recommend now.

Iram Siddique: Even if the teachers want to recommend like a separate prayer room, which we have in certain institutions, even at the airports and so on and so forth. You don’t have that kind of room. I mean, the members don’t have that kind of room to make any kind of recommendation. So what did they essentially do? They traced who the girl was, because in the video only the back of the girl is visible. So we didn’t know for sure who the student was. They traced the girl they called her and they made her record a statement before the inquiry committee in which they asked her whether it was actually you the girl said ki, yes, it was me and I was offering namaz and I have been doing this since 2018, since she joined the University and she raised a very valid point she said that, you know, when the orientation happens, every single rule of the university is spelled out for us. What are the do’s and the don’ts? At that point of time, they were never told that you’re not supposed to indulge in these kinds of religious activities. Had I known all of this, I would have not done that. And it was not that the students were seeing her offering namaz for the first time because her classmates and even her teachers were well aware of this fact.

Shashank Bhargava: In fact it seems clear from the sequence of events that this incident became a controversy because someone took Sadaf’s video without permission. And then right wing groups shared the video and demanded that the university should take some action. Iram says that the committee set up by the university also asks other whether she wanted to file an FIR, against the person who had taken her video. But she said that she did not want to do that.

Iram Siddique: So I went back and I sought an answer from the university as to what did you do? And why is it that you issue a notification after an incident has come to light barring students from religious activity? I mean, if this was the set norm from earlier, the student should have been aware. So the media spokesperson of the University told me that no university per se issues guidelines saying that students cannot practice their faith or cannot indulge in any kind of religious activity. It so happened that a situation was created at the university and looking at that particular situation we were made to issue a notification as to what should be done and should not be done. Besides they also said that although the viral video does have a voiceover of a student talking about the girl praying namaz and all of that, the university official said it is very difficult for us to trace the actual student from the voice in the video. It is something that falls in the legal domain and perhaps the police will be able to deal with it better had the girl you know been in favour of a legal action

Shashank Bhargava: Iram says that solder is a very meritorious student. And her family has invested a lot in her education.

Iram Siddique: Her parents have really, you know, invested in her education. Her father was telling me that we enrolled her in Bundelkhand public school, which was the only private English medium school in that district at that point of time. They said whenever we used to go to her school on days when her results were declared we would first look at the notice board or the blackboard in the class because you would always find her name amongst the rankers there. I mean, although it was not that every year she topped but she would be amongst the rankers. So he was very proud of her achievement. She wants to become a plane Graduate Teacher and here we have professional examination board, which is basically earlier it was called the vyapam. And now it is called the professional examination board which conducts examination for recruitment into government jobs. So she appeared for that examination also for a plain graduate teacher and she secured 127 out of 150, which was the highest in her own class in her own batch.

Shashank Bhargava: This entire incident has now left her feeling targeted, especially because she knows she did not do anything wrong. In the recent past, we have seen such controversies take place in the context of the hijab ban in Karnataka. But Iram says that the Madhya Pradesh government, at least so far, had been reacting differently to this issue.

Iram Siddique: Even when the Karnataka hijab ban happened despite being a BJP rule state Madhya Pradesh leaders refrain from making any sort of comment on hijab ban in MP. I visited a Muslim dominated school in Bhopal to see the kind of practices adopted here. And I witnessed that a lot of students were whatever they were comfortable in, right from a hijab to a dupatta to school on over and above the school uniform and the teachers were okay. Their main concern was that we strive really hard to get girls students to come to school and be a part of, you know, the education system. If by putting this ban if we will sort of push them away, what purpose are we serving, so this is a stand. Interestingly, our school education minister Indar Singh Parmar had given a statement saying that manipulate government was thinking to get a uniform dress code. And soon after that, he had to go back and he said that his statement was misrepresented in the media and that he did not mean and then Home Minister Narottam Mishra, who is also the state spokesperson clarified that the state government is not looking into getting any kind of new policy, or they weren’t very sure whether they want to ban Hijab. And even when the Karnataka High Court passed that verdict, Madhya Pradesh state refrained from making any kind of comment or even you know, sort of banning hijab in schools in Madhya Pradesh or in Bhopal. That has been the case. So, when I spoke to a lot of leaders, they felt that this particular issue of hijab ban was hurting them electorally, in the sense that they felt that when they brought in triple talaq that sort of helped the BJP connect with the Muslim voters, especially the women voters, but this particular issue was pushing them away on whatever little gains that or inroads that they had made. So it felt like a diktat from the centre wherein, you know, they were asked to stay away from it, and that’s what happened. So despite of all the communal clashes and increased communal clashes that we have witnessed in the state, there has been a lul or a silence on this particular issue.

Shashank Bhargava: You were listening to three things by the Indian Express. Today’s show was written and produced by Mr. Shashank Bharagava, and was edited and mixed by Suresh Pawar. If you like the show, then do subscribe to us wherever you get your podcast. You can also recommend the show to someone you think will like it. Share it with a friend or someone in your family. It’s the best way for people to get to know about us. You can tweet us at @Expresspodcasts and write to us at podcasts@indianexpress.com