‘If India fears infiltration, they should talk’

You are talking about war while the Indian PM has been talking of peace in the recent days. He says he is waiting for a response from Pakistan.
We welcome his statements. I think he has shown great statesmanship, considering that some of his cabinet colleagues making aggressive — in fact, I would say, belligerent — statements against Pakistan. Vajpayee has shown statesmanship by distancing himself from those statements. People put a lot of ‘‘ifs’’ and ‘‘buts’’ to his statements — saying that Vajpayee said this, one day, and something completely different, the other day.

But I say I am not a cynical man. I take the Indian Prime Minister’s statement at face value and desire peace as much as him. However, there is a danger here. The people of India and Pakistan are stakeholders in this peace process. It seems only the elite have been determining the shape of Indo-Pak relations, which is wrong. The common man in both the countries has been fooled over the last 55 years. Our people should understand that there are forces which do not want peace between India and Pakistan. Whenever a sectarian killing takes place in Pakistan, we say RAW is behind this. Similarly, a killing in India is always blamed on Pakistani agencies. The people should not accept such allegations blindly. You say you want assurances. The Prime Minister of India says he wants an end to what he says is cross-border terrorism. First of all, Pakistan does not encourage terrorism of any kind. President Musharraf has even given assurances to the international community in this regard. Still, India keeps saying that we encourage infiltration. We say we don’t. The only way out of this deadlock is to have unconditional talks. If we say that India has to accept UN resolutions before any talks begin, it means that we do not want to talk.

You mentioned infiltration. I would like to point out that a recent report of the CIA — presented to the Senate Intelligence Committee — accused Pakistan of supporting terrorism in Kashmir?
Since you have mentioned a CIA report, I must tell you that a State Department Report, and another by Amnesty International, accuses India of state terrorism. Are we going to indulge in point scoring? Should India keep accusing Pakistan and should we do the same? We have already spent 55 years doing this and nobody has gained. I think it’s time to begin talks with an open heart and open mind, so that the lives of 1.5 billion people of the region could improve. The animosity between our two countries has affected their lives. The socio-economic indicators of the region are only better than sub-Saharan Africa. I think we should rise above petty arguments and talk to each other instead of talking at each other.

If we were to talk about the ground realities, summer is approaching and snow will soon start melting in Kashmir. Normally, infiltration into Indian Kashmir increases during this period. Would you be in a position to give an assurance to India that infiltration won’t happen this year?
We give full assurance, because we have said that we don’t encourage infiltration. But if India really fears an increase in what it calls cross-border terrorism, it is all the more reason for talks to begin at the earliest. If talks begin, new forces in favour of peace will be generated and they will not be limited to India and Pakistan. They will also affect the people of Kashmir. It is very obvious that India and Pakistan are necessary parties to this dispute. Pakistan can’t solve this issue by ignoring India. Similarly, India should not think that it can solve the Kashmir issue by bypassing Pakistan. And both of us should not think that we can solve the issue by bypassing the people of Kashmir. They are the worst affected by the dispute. So, we should all get together and begin talking. If we talk, and talk soon, all the stakeholders would work for peace and, god willing, this feared stepping up of violence in the summer won’t take place.

You seem all for talks. The Indian Prime Minister has extended the offer of friendship again. How do you respond to that?
I’m ready today, but I don’t want to make an offer that India rejects. The last time we invited India for SAARC, Prime Minister Vajpayee and Foreign Minister Yashwant Sinha did not come. Now I am the Foreign Minister of Pakistan and I do not make bogus offers. Why can’t the two foreign offices begin official-level talks? We could do this tomorrow rather than wait till the summer. But I have to tell you something. India’s actions so far have been aggressive. They have broken diplomatic ties, downgraded their high commission and even stopped people-to-people contact. In such circumstances, India is likely to reject every offer that Pakistan makes. So, now they could decide on a date and a place and our people will reach there.

But you do remember India did set a place and a date and talks did happen in Agra. What steps could be taken to ensure that these friendly overtures from both the sides result in concrete action?
Yes, the Agra talks did take place and both PM Vajpayee and President Musharraf should be appreciated for that. But you are forgetting that all the newspapers in India were saying then that both were close to an agreement and that an Agra declaration would be signed. Why didn’t that happen? The President was told to come back in 10 minutes. It did not happen because the hardline elements of BJP sabotaged that agreement. We are happy that Prime Minister Vajpayee is asserting leadership once again.

India has always maintained that it does not want third-party interference. If you try to involve Muslim nations or anybody else in this process, don’t you think that would derail any peace efforts?
If India agrees on serious talk tomorrow, I promise that we won’t seek any mediation. India says that under Shimla agreement, it is a bilateral issue. When we want to talk to India, it does not want to talk to us. When we take the issue to Muslim nations or EU or US or UN, India repeats it bilateral issue argument. Bilateral does not mean that India won’t talk to us. If India is serious about talks, we won’t bring any third party in.

Let me be clear on this, you say you are ready for talks without any mediation?
Yes, we are. But these talks should be meaningful and sustained. We understand that there can be no peace if India’s priorities are ignored. Similarly, Pakistan’s priorities cannot be ignored.

So is Pakistan considering a new date for the SAARC summit?
Yes, we are and we’ll give these out soon. We hope that the friendly statements that PM Vajpayee is making are carried to their logical conclusion. I would like to reiterate that the new date will be decided in consultation with India, and both the PM and the Foreign Minister should come to Pakistan.

How soon do you think summit could happen?
I would like this to happen within a month. But this will depend on whether the dates suite the other countries of the region.

(Courtesy: BBCHindi.com)