"All Government decisions are taken by Sukhbir Badal and his father merely puts his stamp wherever required"

•Manraj Grewal: Should the Prime Minister persist with the nuclear deal?

Amarinder Singh: I am all for it. We are facing a severe energy crisis. The other alternatives aren’t that effective. Look at Punjab. Despite abundant rainfall, the state is facing power shortages. The gestation period in other projects is inordinately long. The same goes for thermal plants. To produce approximately 500 MW in Punjab, we spend close to Rs 3,800 crore and we are fetching coal from far-off places. The nuclear deal is in our favour. We seem to have got better terms than what even China managed to get. The Prime Minister should go ahead with it.

•Harpreet Bajwa: You are so enthusiastic about nuclear power now, but while you were chief minister you were categorical that Punjab should never have a nuclear power plant.

Amarinder Singh: I am not against nuclear plants. I am not in favour of setting them up in a densely populated state like Punjab. They should be set up in states like Rajasthan and the power generated can be contributed to the national grid. If you establish nuclear plants in densely populated areas, there is always the danger of a disaster like Chernobyl.

•Raghav Ohri: The incumbent government in Punjab alleges that while in power you pursued politics of vendetta.

Amarinder Singh: During the 2002 election campaign, we had made it clear that corruption in the then Akali government was a major issue for us. We promised in our manifesto that if we came to power we would inquire into the disproportionate assets of Badal and his family. We conducted investigations for over 15 months. Subsequently, we went to court. After listening to all the evidence, the court felt that there was prima facie evidence and ordered the arrest of those found guilty. So, what is there to complain about?

•Sukhdeep Kaur: You seem to be fighting on multiple fronts — against the Akalis and with state Congress chief Rajinder Kaur Bhattal. Comment.

Amarinder Singh: I am a soldier and I know that the morale of my men would hit a nadir if I start to consort with the enemy. How would they feel if I cross the border every evening to have coffee with the Chinese and then in the morning ask them to fight? The same situation prevails in the Congress. The Akalis are persecuting our men, as many as 6,000 cases have been registered against our supporters and workers. Some of them have been mercilessly thrashed at police stations. I have photographic evidence to prove this. Under the circumstances, how can you have bonhomie dinners and fancy cricket matches that Bhattal is having with the Akalis. Just two days before the panchayat elections, Foreign Minister Pranab Mukherjee visited Punjab and you have photographs of Bhattal and Badal sitting in a car, grinning from ear to ear. This sends a wrong message and is bad leadership.

•Manraj Grewal: The present Punjab Chief Minister blames the Congress for most problems that have afflicted Punjab, including terrorism. Comment.

Amarinder Singh: That has always been Badal’s pet peeve. But I think it is complete abrogation of responsibility. The likes of Badal and Tohra did not realise their responsibility and allowed themselves to be upstaged by men like Bhindranwale. I was a part of negotiations and I can tell you that when the talks broke down in 1982, the issue was merely the renaming of Frontier Express as Darbar Sahib Express. If we had done that in 1982, the situation wouldn’t have been exacerbated. But things worsened so fast that by 1984, the issue was not only about renaming of a train. A lot of other things had come in and acquired magnified proportions.

•Varinder Bhatia: Do you think the rift between the Government and Dera Sacha Sauda could send Punjab back to the dark days of terrorism?

Amarinder Singh: Everyone in Punjab wants peace. Something must be worked out between the two parties to diffuse the tension. Let us remember one thing: the trouble in the 1980’s started with the Nirankari issue. Those were horrible days when fear loomed large. No one wants a return to those days. I know there are some mad hatters but the vast majority wants peace.

•Nitin Jain: Some people believe that the Congress leadership wants you to play a role outside Punjab now.

Amarinder Singh: I have conveyed to my party that I am not interested in any place other than Punjab. I can contribute positively to my party in Punjab. There is no point posting me to a far-off place like Nagaland, where I don’t know any Naga and neither does a Naga know me. I am not interested in Lok Sabha elections either. Already, my wife is an MP and you can’t have the entire family in it.

•Manraj Grewal: But your party seems to thrive on dynasties. Look at the current obsession with Rahul Gandhi.

Amarinder Singh: People who come from well-known families have an initial advantage, but then it is up to the electorate to accept them or reject them. In the case of Rajiv Gandhi, I remember when Sanjay died, he was very reluctant to enter politics. But he did and people gave him their mandate with a thumping majority. The same can be said of Rahul Gandhi. People like him and that is why he won from Amethi.

•Dinker Vashisht: Do you think that Pratap Singh Kairon’s prophecy has come true that once Punjab was trifurcated into Punjab, Haryana and Himachal, the state would never enjoy the same prominence on the national scene?

Amarinder Singh: It is true to a large extent. Sardar Pratap Singh Kairon had a lot of foresight. When Punjab was developed after 1947, its entire industrial area was around Faridabad. The area was selected due to its proximity to the national capital region and nearness to railheads. Once the state was divided, that industrial area went to Haryana. Punjab suffers from an image problem: because we like to live a good life, everyone assumes that everything must be great. But when 74 per cent of our farmers own less than four acres of land in the state, there’s not much farming for them. That is why you hear about farmers’ suicides.

•Jaskiran Kaur: Punjab seems to be lagging behind on lots of fronts. What is your biggest concern?

Amarinder Singh: Improvements have to be made in primary education. Recently, the region has seen the opening of several research and technology centres. This move would be futile in the absence of talented people who can attend them. As chief minister I realised the importance of primary education. But we had a paucity of funds. So, I roped in the corporate sector. For instance, we brought in the Bharti group and asked them to take over 60 schools and run them. We were to provide the teachers. But the Akalis unnecessarily provoked our teachers to launch an agitation.

•Manraj Grewal: Why is most of the investment coming to Punjab in real estate?

Amarinder Singh: During my tenure, we cleared a total investment of Rs 1,70,000 crore for the state. Fifty per cent of this pertained to industrial projects. The remaining 50 per cent comprised real estate. We understood that if Punjab is to grow, it cannot depend upon agriculture alone. When I took over as CM, the growth rate was 3.7 per cent and when I left it was 5.3 per cent. In 2002, the price of land in some of the border districts of the state was as low as Rs 50,000 per acre. Today, it is close to Rs 10 lakh per acre.

•Preeti Prashar: Apart from the refinery in Bathinda, Punjab hasn’t had much success in attracting FDI.

Amarinder Singh: I feel that Punjab missed the IT bus. We tried for a lot of projects and people did show interest. Several projects, approved by us, were subsequently cancelled by the current government. Now look at the plethora of real estate societies that have come up in the suburbs of Chandigarh: they look like honeycombs. They are vacant and derelict. I frequently draw parallels between Punjab and Dubai. What did Dubai have? When I met the current ruler, Sheikh Mohammad, he told me that Dubai had nothing but Dawoods, deserts and donkeys. There were no abundant reserves of oil or gas either. It was then that they saw an opportunity in trading and set about building infrastructure. This world-class infrastructure was what prompted so many top companies to set up base in Dubai. Punjab also must develop its infrastructure to get investments.

•Dinker Vashisht: Your move to circumvent the Supreme Court decision in the Sutlej Yamuna Link (SYL) canal issue by abrogating the water agreements with retrospective effect set a bad precedent. Several other water disputes, like the Kaveri one, got a fresh lease of life. Comment.

Amarinder Singh: The genesis of terrorism in Punjab was water disputes. I have been a witness to 12 years of terrible bloodshed. During that time, 35,000 people were killed; as many as 3,000 policemen lost their lives. If I don’t learn from history and don’t stop things that have the potential to plunge the state into terrorism, then I don’t deserve to be the chief minister. It is unfortunate, that water disputes in other parts of the country arose because of my action, but I did it with the interest of Punjab foremost in my mind.

•Vipin Pubby: Did you consult your party leadership before taking the decision?

Amarinder Singh: They did not know about it. As per the Supreme Court directive, we were supposed to hand over the canals to CPWD on a Tuesday. I was in Delhi on the Saturday immediately before that. I was told that a solution could be the abrogation of treaties with retrospective effect. I met a top legal authority in Delhi who confirmed this, but warned that I could get sacked in the process. I reached Chandigarh on Sunday evening. A draft of the Bill was prepared by next morning. An Assembly session was in progress and we showed the Bill to the Akalis exactly one hour before it was to be presented in the House. They gave their assent. Thankfully, the Bill was passed. We sent it to the Governor, who also was under the impression that we had taken the assent of the party leadership. So he approved it. Mrs Sonia Gandhi was miffed with me. She didn’t talk to me for a good eight months and when she asked me why didn’t I inform her about my proposed actions, I replied by asking her — would you have allowed it. She replied in negative and I said, that is why I didn’t ask you.

•Sukhdeep Kaur:  What is your opinion of the father-son duo of Parkash and Sukhbir Badal?

Amarinder Singh: Senior Badal is a man of great experience. He is not very sharp and has a habit of keeping things to himself. He doesn’t like confrontation. But younger Badal would be a complete disaster for the state. He is a headstrong boy whose functioning is against every norm of democracy. I hear that he calls officers for meetings. Surely, this is a violation of constitutional authority? All Government decisions are taken by Sukhbir and his father merely puts his stamp wherever required.

•Harpreet Bajwa: Your confrontation with Sukhbir Badal often features some choicest invectives from both sides. Don’t you think it is inappropriate?

Amarinder Singh: Well, I have merely called him baloongra, which in Punjabi means a small male cat. They are such adorable creatures. Don’t you like them?

•Ritu Sharma: Much has been made by the media of your relationship with Pakistani journalist Aroosa Alam.

Amarinder Singh: Aroosa is an old friend. She was a friend and will remain one. There is nothing bad in that. I get to hear so many absurd things. Some people made the ludicrous statement that I married her in March. There is no substance to these rumours.

•Dinker Vashisht: But there are murmurs that she is a Pakistani agent?

Amarinder Singh: Again, these are terrible accusations that you make when you want to hit someone below the belt. Do you think that our intelligence agencies are so incompetent that they wouldn’t have identified her by now?

•Varinder Bhatia: Do you think your party was fair to your brother-in-law Natwar Singh in the Volcker episode?

Amarinder Singh: I think Natwar Singh should have immediately resigned when his name figured in the controversy. He should have said categorically that he would join the Cabinet once his name is cleared.

•Parul: We hear you are writing a book?

Amarinder Singh: Yes, it deals with the period in Punjab history from the death of Maharaja Ranjit Singh in 1839 to annexation of Punjab by the British in 1849. It is a 350-page book and I have called it The Last Sunset, because Punjab was the last major region to be captured by the British before they proclaimed that the sun never sets on the Empire.

Transcript prepared by Dinker Vashisht