PM Modi on Nikhil Kamath’s podcast: World trusts us, for peace… I tell Russia & Ukraine, Israel & Palestine

“The world trusts us because there is no duplicity in us. What we say is clear. We repeatedly said we are not neutral. I am in favour of peace, and I will cooperate in every effort for it. I tell this to Russia and Ukraine, Israel and Palestine. Our credibility has increased because of this. The world thinks that India says what it believes.”

“In Abu Dhabi, when I wanted a temple for Hindus, I got it from the Crown Prince in a moment. What a happy moment this was for crores of Hindus,” he said.

PM Modi, tweeting the trailer of the podcast on Thursday night wrote, “I hope you all enjoy this as much as we enjoyed creating it for you!”

I hope you all enjoy this as much as we enjoyed creating it for you! https://t.co/xth1Vixohn

— Narendra Modi (@narendramodi) January 9, 2025

He recalled how Chinese President Xi Jinping once told him that they shared a “special connection”.

He said when he became Prime Minister in 2014, “President Xi, during a courtesy call, said to me he wished to come to India, travel to Gujarat, Vadnagar in particular. I said he was most welcome. He said we share a special connection.”

Modi quoted Xi as telling him that the Chinese scholar Hiuen Tsang, when he travelled to India, stayed for long in his village Vadnagar and in Xi’s village when he returned to China.

For the first time in several years, he spoke of the Godhra train burning incident and the criticism that followed the Gujarat riots in 2002.

Responding to a question on how he dealt with anxiety, he recalled the 2002 incidents. “On February 24, 2002, I first became  MLA. On February 27, I went to the (Gujarat) Assembly for the first time. Within three days as MLA, news came of the Godhra carnage. I said I want to go to Godhra, taking a helicopter from Baroda. There was just a single-engine ONGC helicopter available at that time. They refused, saying a VIP cannot be flown in a single-engine helicopter. I said I would give an undertaking in writing that I was willingly taking the risk. I took the helicopter to Godhra, and saw the bodies. I felt restless but I knew that in my post (as CM), I had to control myself and rise above emotions.”

He also mentioned how he was denied a visa to the US after the Gujarat riots. “I was an elected Chief Minister here, and the US refused to give me a visa. I felt this was an insult to the country and an elected government, just because some people spread some lies. I addressed a press conference that day and said I want an India where the world will stand in a queue for our visa. I can see the time now is India’s,” he said.

Stating that becoming a politician was one thing and succeeding in politics quite another, Modi said the latter required living among the people and associating with their lives. He said becoming a politician was not the same as becoming an MLA or MP alone, emphasising that dedication and commitment were far more important. Oratory, he said, could stand a politician in good stead for a while, but communication was more than oratory.

He cited the example of the Mahatma. “Look at Mahatma Gandhi. Personality-wise, he was thin. His oratory was next to nothing. But he became a leader because his life conveyed his message. He could make the country rise. Today, we appreciate oratory. It may work for some time, but the final thing is commitment. Communication is more important than oratory. Mahatma Gandhi walked with a stick taller than himself but was non-violent… He did not wear a cap but the Gandhi topi became popular… He never went after power or office but his memorial is called Rajghat.”

Modi said while ideology had a place in politics, idealism was far more important. The mission, he said, could be the same even if the paths taken are different. In this context, he cited the examples of Gandhi and V D Savarkar.

“My tagline is nation first. I do whatever fits it, without getting bound by ideology or traditions. I am willing to leave old things and accept new ones. But I never change the benchmark. It remains nation first. More than ideology, idealism matters. Before independence, freedom was the ideology. Gandhi’s path and Savarkar’s were different, but both wanted freedom,” he said.

Modi accepted that he too might have committed mistakes, but that he never had any wrong intention. “Main bhi manushya hi hoon, koi devata thode hi na hoon (I am also human, I am not a god).”

He said politicians should be sensitive and also accept that there will be personal attacks on them. He said he often told children, who asked him how he coped with criticism, a joke about people from Ahmedabad: “I tell children a joke. An Ahmedabadi, riding a scooter, came very close to a collision. As the other person began to abuse him, the Ahmedabadi stood quietly. Asked by someone why he was silent while being constantly abused, the Ahmedabadi said the person was giving him something, and not taking something away from him. That is what I believe. Let them abuse, but you should be true to yourself and not have wrong intentions.” “There was a time when we Jana Sangh people were abused even if we had done nothing wrong. But those were days of the print media. Today, you have alternative means to seek the truth. The youth of today verify things,” he said.

Asked whether he had been able to live up to his slogan ‘Minimum Government, Maximum Governance’, Modi said, “People misinterpreted the meaning of the slogan of Minimum Government, Maximum Governance, thinking there would be fewer ministers and officials. I did not think about that – I made Skill, Cooperative and Fisheries Ministries too.” What he meant, he said, was to cut down long processes. He said he had removed 40,000 compliances, revoked about 1500 laws, and changed the penal laws. “This is my idea of Minimum Government, Maximum Governance.”

“Today I can send money in the accounts of 10 crore farmers in 30 seconds. Jan Dhan removed corruption. Foreign dignitaries get surprised seeing our UPI, I tell them to go to a vendor and see. I say that nothing is needed after one has a mobile phone in the pocket,” he said.