‘First we will make Katraj clean,beautiful and duplicate that experiment elsewhere’

We at Janwani are working on a very nice project at Katraj. Katraj is the biggest ward of the municipal corporation. And it has all kinds of things such as apartments,gaothan,old village,bungalows and a lake. So we thought first we will make Katraj a clean and beautiful place and replicate that experiment elsewhere. Ragpickers collect dry and wet garbage separately from each household and dump it in a tempo. The tempo takes it to segregation and reprocessing units where it is allowed to be segregated on its own. Separate land has been given by the corporation. Dry waste is easily segregated. We are buying a machine to compress wet waste and make fuel sticks out of it so that it can be sold. So garbage need not be taken to Phursungi. It can be collected from each household,reprocessed in the ward itself and consumed there. So whatever the corporation is spending on collection and transportation will be saved. An agency will collect garbage from households,reprocess it and sell the fuel sticks and earn profits. In doing so,we are earning in two ways. Each household is willing to pay Rs 30 for garbage collection per month,so if there are 6,000 households,we will collect Rs 1.8 lakh. The corporation is willing to pay what they are spending on collection and transportation. They are spending Rs 1,300 per tonne on collection and transport to Phursungi. After we process it,we will sell it and earn money. All this will pay for the whole setup. Everybody is happy. They are also saying if our health improves,we don’t have to spend on doctors’ bill and insurance.

GEETA NAIR: What about the equipment,the plant?

Well,initially we will run. But later,when it becomes self sustaining,then people will employ their own ragpickers and run it. The plant is expensive at the moment. About Rs 30 lakh,but much cheaper than a gas plant. But if there are 144 orders,then the cost will come down. First one we are helping,out of our CSR (corporate social responsibility). We want to make a model project that is economically viable.

AJAY KHAPE: There are political parties who want their own organisations to do the job.

We are not claiming that only Swach will do it. We are interested in making a viable model.

PRANAV KULKARNI: Recent reports say there is a dip in India’s FII,so much so that we are behind even Pakistan. What’s the reason?

…there is a feeling that Mauritius-based companies will not have tax advantage in future. Lot of money which was going abroad was getting re-routed through Mauritius. Now,the tax advantage will be gone is what people are realising. So a lot of ‘so-called’ FII is Indian money going out and coming back and people are thinking that it won’t be so any longer.

GEETA NAIR: What will happen once the tax advantage is gone?

Those who had unaccounted money realised that India is the place to invest. India is progressing at 7- 8-9 per cent a year. So it is not intelligent to keep money in banks in western countries. Might as well bring it to India. Since it is unaccounted,how to bring it? So form a company in Mauritius and invest in an Indian company. So,it is Indian money going out and coming back. Once tax advantage is gone,people will find ways to invest directly. If India itself becomes low tax country,then money will not go out. Unaccounted money will also be released. Why we should tax people so much is an issue in itself. Our tax rates are too high. They were ridiculously high at one time. But even today,compared to the services that government is providing,out tax rates are high. Almost 70- 80 per cent of the tax revenue goes towards salaries of government servants. Hardly 10-20 per cent is used by the person supposed to use it. If a government servant becomes 100 per cent more efficient,then expenditure on him can come down from 80 per cent to 40 per cent. That means tax revenue can go down by 50 per cent and then even income tax can be abolished. Why collect income tax? Collect one goods and services tax,that also at reasonable rate. Even 50 per cent tax rate is too high. If it is less than 10 per cent and that also,only one,then people will not mind paying tax. If Government reduces tax rate then why should money go out and come back? Rather than trying to plug loopholes,the government should create an environment that people are not encouraged to evade tax. In Dubai for instance,there is no tax. Dubai does not have (high) oil reserves. Still they are managing to run the country with no tax. Why should Indians be not be able to do that?

GEETA NAIR: Has the pace of reform slowed down in the past couple of years?

The central government has done a lot of reforms. The state government needs do a lot. First and foremost,abolish the Agricultural Produce Market Committees (APMC) Act. You won’t believe,but it prohibits a farmer from selling his goods directly to the consumer. So he has no option but go through a middle man.

SUSHANT KULKARNI: A recent study suggested that more than 50 per cent of agriculture loan is actually disbursed in urban areas.Do you think there is any requirement of any further laws to stop this?

There is a need for farmers to receive loans because they have to plant the next crop,buy seeds,till the land,and for that they should not have to sell the produce. They should be able to hold on until they get a good rate in the market,but still plant the next crop. That is in everybody’s interest,even in an urban guy’s interest. Today,he is forced to sell his produce at throwaway prices because he does not have access to loans. So the government should create a food bank where a farmer is allowed to bring his produce and store it. For storing,we charge him some money and the farmer will be happy to store. Secondly,he can take it out whenever he wants to and sell it if there is a good market rate. There should be a food bank in every mandi town, at least 1-2 banks in every town.

NISHA NAMBIAR: There are so many issues surrounding the Chakan airport.

The government should make a 50-year plan for land use… that we want the area to develop like this. There will be industries,airport,school here and then move in that direction. Unless you make a 50-year plan,you will have problems. How to make a plan? There are good town planners in our country and examples to follow from the rest of the world. Airport will happen. Finally,pressure will be built up.

PRANAV KULKARNI: Is there a lack of political will?

Politicians are interested,but our system is so complex. So many ministries are involved in decision-making. The central government has 60- 70 ministries or may be even more. For any decision,six-seven ministers have to come together. Take for instance,the auto sector… Transport Ministry,Heavy Industries Ministry,environment Ministry,Energy Ministry and Fuel Ministry secretaries will have to attend the meeting. Such meetings can take place once in three months. So at least two years are taken for minor decisions. If the system had only one ministry,that minister or secretary could have made the decision. Our complexity of system is the problem. I don’t think politicians or bureaucrats are not working hard. They work quite hard- even at night. Ramesh Wanjale died recently,so one can imagine the pressure. Our system is complex. In US,there are only 11 ministries,so why should we have more? In Industry itself there are three ministries…Petroleum,Steel and Mines. No decision can ever be made unless we reduce complexities.

SUSHANT KULKARNI: Is it the same thing happening to Metro? Too many decisions,aspects bodies involved?

Metro is not properly thought out in my opinion. It is being rushed through without applying the mind. I personally feel that Metro should be underground. It will be more expensive but do it step by step. One can charge according to the route… Rs 5 say,for the core city and Rs 100 for Hinjewadi where people can afford it.

PRANAV KULKARNI: After Solekshaw (battery-operated vehicle) for postmen,are there any such innovations from your side?

I am also the chairman of research council of CSIO a CSIR laboratory and we are working on some interesting projects. One is how blind people can read. We have developed an instrument that you can just keep on the book and it starts reading. You can change the speed… also male voice and female voice. We will be converting it into a translator-cum-reader so if a newspaper or book is in English,you can read it in Marathi. The prototype is ready. Then we are working on an artificial limb which can make all the movements… grip etc. We are also working on assistance for old people. Old people do not have strength in their legs so they cannot climb up Vaishnodevi.

The device will add to whatever strength your leg has. It will read how your leg behaves and duplicate that motion parallel to your keg. Prototypes have been made. Now,we have to launch it.

We have made many such prototypes. One is earthquake prediction. During earthquakes,there are horizontal and vertical waves. Right now,the gap between two waves is 15 seconds. So if the wave can be sensed,Metros and nuclear plants can be warned. Already,we have made a landslide prediction model… unique in the world. Nowhere in the world is this model available. We are trying it out in Jammu & Kashmir. There is also a device to check milk adulteration by portable meters. We are also working on precision farming… The system will be behind the tractor. The instruments will sense moisture and pH value of soil. All the data will go to a scientist who will advice farmers to help maximise yield. A pilot has been made. Also milk pasteurisation… passing high voltage pulse to kill germs… We are now working on breast cancer,hopefully tuberculosis would be next. Unfortunately,such experiments are never publicised.

SUNANDA MEHTA: You recently talked about how middle class indifference needs to be tackled. With reference to Pune in particular. Is that why so many of the city’s problems don’t get solved?

Middle class does not want to go and cast vote and elections are deliberately kept on Saturdays. I once asked an election officer why they keep elections on Saturdays. He said because we do not want you to come and vote. On asking why,he said because you vote against us. If middle class,which is 30-40 per cent in Pune,comes together and decides to vote for a good candidate irrespective of party, A,B,C or independent,they can swing the elections. Also,there should be provisions that if there is no candidate they find eligible,they should vote for ‘none of the above’. And if ‘none of the above’ is the choice of more than 50 per cent voters,there should be a re-poll. Each election costs Rs 10 crore. This will make them take interest in what the middle class says. It does not need a constitutional amendment,even election commissioner can do it.