‘Earlier, stars were launched. Now if an actor does two good scenes, he will get better opportunities’

On his breakout role in Masaan

Kaushal: At that time, I was just a boy looking for opportunities, a very hungry and stubborn boy. I auditioned for Masaan (2015) and got selected. Apart from Richa Chadha and Sanjay Mishraji, it was everybody’s first film. So it was made with a lot of purity. It was a lot of novices coming together with a lot of passion for that breakout opportunity. I went to Banaras about three weeks before we started shooting and tried to just be one with the place. Apart from learning the language, the culture, about the Dom community (that cremates bodies), I had an audio track which was just ‘Ram Naam Satya Hai’. I used to put that on my headphones and would try to sleep to that music. At first, it used to be very haunting but I tried it because for the boy Deepak (the character he plays, who belongs to the Dom community) it must have been his lullaby. He has lived there only. I spent a lot of time at the cremation ground. I remember the first time I went there, I couldn’t sit there for 15 minutes but eventually I was able to spend days over there, was able to have a cup of tea right next to a burning pyre and say ‘shakkar kam hai’ (the sugar is less). So it was just surrendering to that whole world.

On whether playing Sam Manekshaw made him nervous

Kaushal:  There’s a certain kind of responsibility that you feel when you are wearing the Indian Army uniform, and this was Field Marshal Sam Manekshaw’s uniform. I used to make a conscious decision when I used to leave my van… I would just believe that I was that man and I went with that conviction. I tried to make him my friend. I tried to make him like my own, so his magnanimity never made me nervous because that would have affected my confidence.

On her treatment of the protagonists in Raazi and Sam Bahadur

Gulzar: It’s not that I didn’t love her (the protagonist in Raazi). I empathised. There was a lot more empathy than love. There was also a lot of grey in the character. With Sam, there is reverence and only reverence. There is no black, no white, no grey. It’s just because of the person that he was or maybe how I’ve absorbed him or internalised him, and so that was my approach in writing the film, in executing the scenes, in looking at him in every shot. I don’t know whether everybody will notice it but my camera is never at his eye level, it’s always looking up at him.

On the 15-year gap between her two films

Gulzar: Like we have BC and AD, my life is before Talvar and after Talvar. That’s how I divide my life.

The first 15 years of my career, from the release of Filhaal, the films didn’t meet with success and when your films don’t meet with success, getting work is difficult. It doesn’t matter what your surname is — so that is my explanation for the ‘N’ word that people keep throwing at us all the time. What switched on was Vishal Bhardwaj. It was him who threw the idea of Talvar at me and I thank my stars that I said yes in a blink. I think what changed was the stories that I began to tell after that, so the stories became real, they became tougher, they made me work harder. I think that’s what started working with the audience that was watching my films, so I really can’t say that I switched on something in myself. I think it’s the stories that found me that changed something in me.

I was following the (Aarushi Talwar) case like everybody else was and I was also constantly flipping between what I was believing… Of course, I would want to understand what actually went down. I was not only a mother, I was also a daughter. So, it was very difficult to execute without having any kind of emotional investment in the film.

On not villainising the enemy

Gulzar: I believe a person is who she is purely because of circumstances. Which side of the circumstance you are on makes you either the hero or the villain and the person who’s calling you a hero or a villain depends on that person’s perspective. With Raazi (2018), I honestly believe that there was no hero or villain. With Sam Bahadur, there is no scope for villainising anybody. It’s not that story and he’s not that man. He fought to defend his country without villainising his enemy, otherwise the treatment that he gave to the 93,000 prisoners of war we had would not have been given. He treated them with humanity and with respect that a soldier merits, so there he was not villainising them.

Rapid Fire

Meghna Gulzar

The one time you’ve lost it on set.

We got some badges and ribbons wrong and it was a serious mistake.

If you were forced to make a movie on any of the following events that The Indian Express has played a significant role in, which would you choose: Bofors, Panama papers, the Emergency, ICICI Videocon transactions?

The Emergency is already being made. The others are very boring.

If there’s a chance to remake one classic film, what would it be?

You don’t touch classics.

The one perk of being Gulzar’s daughter.

Gulzar: Perks, I still have to find one, but yes, I have a lyricist on call, on-demand,
24/7 for me when I’m making my films.

Kaushal: Can I also give an anecdote? We were on set and there were untimely rains. She doesn’t carry her phone when she is shooting, but I saw with a phone. I was like, ‘Who are you texting’, and she says, ‘Papa’. She says, ‘Every time it rains, I message him, saying, please stop the rain’. The best part is, he replies, ‘How much time do I have’ and she says, ‘Half an hour’. This is a real conversation! And in half an hour it stops raining!

Bollywood has a habit of flogging a dead horse. Which genre do you think has outstayed its welcome: biopics, horror comedies, small-town dramas or any other

I dare not say biopic right now. Horror comedies or even small-town genres are not flogged yet because there’s always a different interpretation to them.

Before your film Chhapak released, Deepika (Padukone) went to that campus (JNU). Did it make a difference to your film? Did it have any impact at all?

Yes, it did make a dent on the film because the conversation went from acid violence, which I intended the film to amplify to… it changed track and went somewhere else, so of course it impacted the film.

Vicky Kaushal

What’s the weirdest thing you’ve done to prep for a movie?

For Raman Raghav 2.0, I isolated myself for five days with no phones, newspapers, TV, music, and it did not help me. I came out frustrated. So, yes, that was the stupidest thing I did.

What goes on in your mind when your co-actor shows up on the set without having learned his or her lines?

Nothing. I’m too nice a guy!

The one Hindi film you watched that you wish you were in.

Actually, if I’ve loved a film, I get inspired to do something like that but I’ve never felt that I should have been in that film.

Are you disappointed that you’ve got another film (Animal) releasing on the same day?

See, when two opening batsmen come to the crease, playing for the same team, you don’t say that the two batsmen are clashing with each other. They’re playing for one team and similarly we’re playing for Hindi cinema. While one player might hit the fours and the sixes, the other player will be at the crease and will take ones and twos and maintain the strike.

If you had to pick one biography to play, who would you choose: Rohit Sharma or Virat Kohli.

Well, the audience is saying Virat Kohli!

The Internet calls you a green flag husband. What’s the one red flag you worked on getting rid of?

So, the biggest complaint Katrina has always had is that I’m sometimes too stubborn. That needed a little bit of moderation.

The one thing you miss about being single.

I’ve said this before, the Miss is now my Mrs, so it’s all good.

Who does Katrina have the best on-screen chemistry with?

Akshay Kumar. I love Namaste London.

On Raman Raghav 2.0

Kaushal: It was a film directed by Anurag Kashyap. I was playing a cop, which my mother was very happy about, but I did not give her the details of what kind of a cop he is. It was a very dark and twisted story about a cop and a serial killer. So how was I able to play it? I still feel it’s my worst performance till date. I am not surprised, though, because I just felt like I hadn’t lived enough experiences to fully get into the depth of that guy. That is one role I feel every five years of my life I will play differently and I will play it better because of the complexities of that person.

I, fortunately, come from a very protective and secure upbringing and that is not what his life was. At the age of 25, when I was playing that part, there was a little bit of a gap that I had to fill to understand and bridge — in retrospect, I feel I couldn’t cover that. I tried my best but I still feel like there’s a lot more I can do today if I get that role.

On being stubborn and pursuing acting

Kaushal: When I first thought I wanted to be an actor, I was doing my engineering — this was about 2007-08. I thought after finishing my graduation, I would pursue acting. I also did not have the confidence to be an actor because at that time actors and stars were launched. Today, fortunately, we are in a time where if an actor appears in a film and does two good scenes, you will Google his name and he will get better opportunities. In 2010, when I started, that was not the environment. But I was a stubborn actor. I used to go for auditions and I would say that I want a role, I want to be an actor and sometimes the other person would be checking me out. That’s when I would become even more confident and say I want to be an actor. So, that stubbornness was actually what gave me confidence.